I have been asked to design and possibly build a custom smoker. a pretty elaborate one actually. without going into too much detail, they want it BRIGHT red or yellow (probably red), with a high-gloss finish.

my instant thought was powdercoat. for the smoke chamber, that would be great. the temps stay relatively low enough, and the powedercoat would allow for super-easy cleanup of any soot or drippings. However, the firebox is another issue. if I were to insulate it, there wouldn't be a problem (I don't think so anyway), but i'm not sure how feasible that will be with this project. I am basing my calculations on my past experiences, mostly with my fridge smoker and it's insulated firebox. I plan on the firebox reaching temps well above 900 degrees if it is un-insulated, so i am planning on about 1500, just to be safe. powedercoat is applied and baked at 400-450*F, so if the firebox reaches the higher temps, it would actually melt and possibly combust.

I have thought about engine enamel... the 2000*F stuff, but every time i use it, i get a very matte finish, which isn't going to work.

the color is very important, as is the gloss finish. if it ends up getting built, it will not only be a show-piece smoker, but it will also be my cornerstone project. there has got to be a way to do this... just gotta think about it. any ideas?

Later,
Andy

Gloss and heat don't get along well, as glosses tend to be hard finishes. And hard finishes don't so well with expansion/contraction. You COULD go with gloss after the firebox. And a matte black firebox looks pretty cool alongside a cherry red smoker...

Go to an automotive paint supply. They have or can order anything you want. Not an auto parts store, an automotive paint store or supply.

would that be a fire engine red?:whistle: Unfortunately I think Rich is right, everything I can find that covers that high of a heat only comes in a flat finish.

Andy,

I'm pretty sure they make a high heat powder coat. It will withstand temperatures up to 1000F.

Try a search on high heat powder coat.

You can prime with this.
http://www.rustoleum.com/CBGProduct.asp?pid=381

Then finish coat with this.
http://www.rustoleum.com/CBGProduct.asp?pid=371&sid=248908

Talk to the powder coat people about Ceramicoat (may be called some thing else) it is used for coating exhaust headers on Hotrods not sure of colors or gloss finish

If you Google...Capps powder coating .. it may help you out with some info

Talk to the powder coat people about Ceramicoat it is used for coating exhaust headers on Hotrods not sure of colors or gloss finish

Here is a website thats local to me for info...Capps powder coating .. may help out

Hmm ceramics...THAT might be the answer!

Their website claims 1300 degrees :noidea:

I actually got the bright idea to call my powedercoater today over lunch... figure that... a powdercoater knowing about his own products? who woulda thunk it? lol

anyway, he told me that there is nothing out there that he is aware of that would hold up to the temps other than blacks and grays. the reason being is colorfastness... red will turn pink or maroon and the yellow will turn brown. the yellow will actually turn colors sooner than the red.

looks like I will be fully insulating the firebox after all...

Later,
Andy

allegedly, ceramic is what gives Duplicolor's 2000*F paint it's heat rating...

A ceramic coating would be a viable option for the firebox. Several online sources for it, especially the aftermarket hot rod performance shops. Same thing as header coating. If I remember right, there are a few color options and the temps are good upwards of 2000 degrees.

allegedly, ceramic is what gives Duplicolor's 2000*F paint it's heat rating...

While you are correct about the ceramic resins in Dupliccolors High Heat Paint, you are incorrect about the temperature.
"Resists temperatures up to 1200 degrees F intermittently"
http://www.jegs.com/p/Duplicolor/Duplicolor-High-Heat-Paint/763072/10002/-1

The Rustoleum that I linked you to earlier is the only high heat paint that I've found that is rated to 2000 degrees. There may be something better out there, but I haven't found it........yet. It appears that insulating the firebox will be your best option at this point. Good luck with your project:thumb:

I vote insulate if you can. If nothing else, for the efficiency...oh and the easy paint choice.

Insulate.

There ain't jackshit out there in a paint that I have found to hold up on a non-insulated firebox in a gloss finish. Ceramics will work... Weber does it well. Not sure of the cost tho...

Ceramics will work... Weber does it well. Not sure of the cost tho...

The first one... $100K. After that they get cheap ;{)

The first one... $100K. After that they get cheap ;{)

Yeah, I'm sure... not a 1z - 2z type of thing...

Insulate.

Ceramics will work... Weber does it well. Not sure of the cost tho...

Weber uses a porcelain-enameled finish on the lid & bowl. It sure does hold up well. http://www.weber.com/explore/Grill_details.aspx?glid=4&mid=23

Weber uses a porcelain-enameled finish on the lid & bowl. It sure does hold up well. http://www.weber.com/explore/Grill_details.aspx?glid=4&mid=23

Yeah, that's what I was talking about... sorry. I wonder how/where/if that could be done on a small quantity level...?

Yeah, that's what I was talking about... sorry. I wonder how/where/if that could be done on a small quantity level...?

I bet it could. Would just have to find a small company that was willing to do small jobs. Or a big company that wanted to do small jobs. My guess is most of this kind of stuff is done overseas as it's used alot on cookware, grates etc. No EPA to worry about either. aczeller is better off insulating or changing his heat source,imo.

Just for S&G's I called Capp's the owner is out till Mon. but the office assistant thought they had a BLACK coating able to withstand 2,000 deg. I will call back on Mon.

You should Rhino line that thing on the outside. That would look awesome. I have thought about doing that to my fridge.

Andy...Just explain to him that the key to a good smoker isnt the paint job...

Oh never mind....

Andy, try Josh Trails right there in Omaha. He has done some motorcycle work for me before. If I remember right (might big if), he can do ceramics in just about any color. You might have to wait until he has enough of one color to make it cost efficient for him. Let me check my extensive and highly organized system of files for his number. Now, which pile do I have that in?

Well it's been said already but I noticed a shop that has a sign out front saying powder coat and ceramic painting. Also check for retailers that sell POR-15 they have some interesting coatings, I found out about them doing a search for a super tough lawnmower deck coating.

Talk to the powder coat people about Ceramicoat (may be called some thing else) it is used for coating exhaust headers on Hotrods not sure of colors or gloss finish

If you Google...Capps powder coating .. it may help you out with some info

Good choice but it's limited in colors. Very high end coating but you'll pay for what your getting. You can get it in gloss too I believe.

what you want is a closoinne manufacturer. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cloisonn%C3%A9)
Basically a powdered fired ceramic. the chinese invented it many centuries ago.
It's metal coated with the ceramic powder and then fired.

Cloisonné is an ancient technique for decorating metalwork objects, in recent centuries using vitreous enamel, and in older periods also inlays of cut gemstones, glass, and other materials. The resulting objects can also be called cloisonné. The decoration is formed by first adding compartments (cloisons in French[1]) to the metal object by soldering or adhering silver or gold wires or thin strips placed on their edges. These remain visible in the finished piece, separating the different compartments of the enamel or inlays, which are often of several colors. Cloisonné enamel objects are worked on with enamel powder made into a paste, which then needs to be fired in a kiln.

The technique was in ancient times mostly used for jewellery and small fittings for clothes, weapons or similar small objects decorated with geometric or schematic designs, with thick cloison walls. In the Byzantine Empire techniques using thinner wires were developed to allow more pictorial images to be produced, mostly used for religious images and jewellery, and now always using enamel. By the 14th century this enamel technique had spread to China, where it was soon used for much larger vessels such as bowls and vases; the technique remains common in China to the present day, and cloisonné enamel objects using Chinese-derived styles were produced in the West from the 18th century.

I've seen vases 5 foot high and about 3 wide in china. so the technique can be used on a large scale.
Plus you're not necessarily going for a complex picture just the flat enamel colour.

How much money are these customers capable of parting with is the big question ?

I have no idea how temperature sound it is, but it's kiln fired ceramic - so should be pretty resistant.

What you want is a second year ceramics student at a big university who's looking for something pretty unusua; for their final year project :-)
Or a ceramics department who's after an unusual project.

Anyway it's a thought :-)

I just don't believe a gloss finish would survive without crazing. I've never seen a gloss exhaust header paint, which would be in the same temp range. I've seen ceramic coated headers craze too. What someone wants and what they get may be two different things.

HPC coat is what I have on my turbo manifold in this pic.....gray and black are all they come in tho.....Honestly if it is going to be a high end smoker the fire box must be insulated anyways so your temps should be ok for high temp powder coating... http://www.hpcoatings.com/
http://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r251/got14u5150/funnys/209.jpg

Cooling chambers if he wants color....Jack on that...Imron is a good hard paint...

Sherwin Williams makes high temp paint in lots of colors and in gloss. it's 1800 to 2000 ° stuff. if you want to see what it looks like, check out the jambo pits. He uses the Sherwin Williams stuff. Rustoleum makes 2000° primer that I would use as your base coat.

Have you notice all the Jambos are painted black. just the surrounding body is colored and the trimmingsSherwin Williams makes high temp paint in lots of colors and in gloss. it's 1800 to 2000 ° stuff. if you want to see what it looks like, check out the jambo pits. He uses the Sherwin Williams stuff. Rustoleum makes 2000° primer that I would use as your base coat.