food danger zone

[zombini]

I came across a post on the net where a person had done a low and slow cook on a pork butt and it was 10 hours before the Pork Butt had reached 140F. Is that OK?

[barkonbutts]

I came across a post on the net where a person had done a low and slow cook on a pork butt and it was 10 hours before the Pork Butt had reached 140F. Is that OK?

I guess how long did it take the surface of the meat to get to 140... did they poke the thermo in prior to 140?? then yes there could be some big trouble..

4 hours to 140 for me!!

[DDave]

If it is unpunctured as in not injected or not poked with a temp probe whole muscle meat then only the outer 1/2" must be above 140° in 4 hours. Or rather should not have cumulative exposure between 40° and 140° for more than 4 hours.

Or as of 2009, 41° to 134°

Biggest Change, the danger zone is now 41 F to 134 F verses the old.

If it was injected or poked with a temp probe then the rule applies to the internal temp.

Dave

[zombini]

After 6 hours the internal was 110. . So a good rule to follow is get to 134 in 4 hours and this applies to all meats? It's hard to say if the meat has been poked or probed. I used to always probe from the start but after hanging out here I wait.

[dcarch]

Something for all to think about.

10.5 % of all beef you buy are already mechanically pierced:

"---According to the US Food Safety and Inspection Service, about 10.5 percent of steaks are subjected to a process called mechanical or needle tenderization, where metal blades or pins repeatedly puncture the meat before packaging. -----"

No labeling is required for the above.

dcarch

[Richtee]

After 6 hours the internal was 110. . So a good rule to follow is get to 134 in 4 hours and this applies to all meats? It's hard to say if the meat has been poked or probed. I used to always probe from the start but after hanging out here I wait.

You don't really need to care about temps outa the gate. Let it go a few hours on the big hunks.

[DDave]

After 6 hours the internal was 110. . So a good rule to follow is get to 134 in 4 hours and this applies to all meats? It's hard to say if the meat has been poked or probed. I used to always probe from the start but after hanging out here I wait.

***DISCLAIMER***
The following is just my opinion. An opinion that has been formed by reading what others who know a lot more about food safety than I do have written on this and other forums that I have been a member of. I am not an expert and do not represent myself as such. There are certain "norms" that most forum members adhere to and that is to err on the side of caution when it comes to food safety. There have been some rousing, um, er, "discussions" when it comes to food safety on the forum and some of them have degenerated into more than just friendly discussions.
*************************************************

Okay,

It is likely a good rule and applies to all uncured meats to my knowledge. Again, unpunctured whole muscle we're talking about the outer shell. Probed, injected, or ground we're talking about internal.

I used to probe from the beginning as well until I learned a little more. Now I don't probe til probably 4 or 5 hours into a brisket or pork butt smoke. And before I insert the probe, I'll wipe it down with a Clorox wipe.

As far as the "needle tenderization" that's kind of scary when you're talking sous vide I would think depending on the cook time.

Dave

[dcarch]

-------As far as the "needle tenderization" that's kind of scary when you're talking sous vide I would think depending on the cook time.

Dave

It is important to put things in perspective.

Bad news -10.5 % of the beef you buy are punctured by "needle tenderization" without your knowledge.

Good news - about 5 deaths are reported to link to those beef in 10 years.

Good news? Well, Cigarette smoking is responsible for more than 480,000 deaths per year in the United States, including an estimated 41,000 deaths resulting from secondhand smoke exposure. In 10 years, that would be 4,800,000 deaths. And cigarettes are still legal.

How scary is sticking a probe in your meat? It is up to you to find meaning in the above numbers.

dcarch

[Richtee]

Hey DC..wanna bum a smoke?

[DDave]

It is important to put things in perspective.

Bad news -10.5 % of the beef you buy are punctured by "needle tenderization" without your knowledge.

Good news - about 5 deaths are reported to link to those beef in 10 years.

Not bad odds.

I'm sure all of the other stuff I eat has a higher chance of killing me than one of those steaks.

Dave

[Bearcarver]

After 6 hours the internal was 110. . So a good rule to follow is get to 134 in 4 hours and this applies to all meats? It's hard to say if the meat has been poked or probed. I used to always probe from the start but after hanging out here I wait.

Yup----Actually 41° to 134° in no longer than 4 hours if seal was broken. However "40 to 140 in 4" is easier to remember.

And if someone says it was 110° after 6 hours, we know it was probed. We just don't know when.


Bear

[zombini]

Lets say my temperature is in the danger zone longer than 4 hours and then I continue to smoke or cook until 200 F. Does this kill the bacteria making it safe to eat or are the little bad guys still running around in the meat?
z

[Bearcarver]

Lets say my temperature is in the danger zone longer than 4 hours and then I continue to smoke or cook until 200 F. Does this kill the bacteria making it safe to eat or are the little bad guys still running around in the meat?
z

It is my understanding that the high heat later in the smoke kills the bacteria, but high heat doesn't kill the toxins that were formed by the bacteria earlier in the smoke.

I'm sure someone can explain that better.


Bear

[zombini]

So finishing the cook doesn't necessarily make it safe to eat...ok thanks

[Richtee]

It is my understanding that the high heat later in the smoke kills the bacteria, but high heat doesn't kill the toxins that were formed by the bacteria earlier in the smoke.

So finishing the cook doesn't necessarily make it safe to eat...ok thanks

that's explained just fine. The bacteria themselves are not the problem so much as their... err... excrement. To be polite about it