Pizza crust, whats the secret?

[Charcuteryan]

I can make evrything from salami to brisket. ( ya we make brisket here in amish country) but I cant get my d@#n pizza crust right. Are you old heads gonna tell me?

[BBQ Engineer]

I can make evrything from salami to brisket. ( ya we make brisket here in amish country) but I cant get my d@#n pizza crust right. Are you old heads gonna tell me?

Barkonbutts is a Pizza guru...I'm sure he'll be round shortly.

[Katillac]

I use this one. Its fast and easy.
ingredients:

1 1/2 cups warm water, 100 to 110 degrees F, plus extra as needed
1 (1/4-ounce) packet active dry yeast
5 cups all-purpose flour, plus extra as needed
1 1/2 teaspoons fine sea salt
Olive oil, for drizzling

Directions

Put the water in a small bowl. Add the yeast and stir until dissolved.

In a large bowl, whisk the flour and salt together. Add the yeast mixture and stir until a soft dough forms. If the dough is too dry, add a little extra water, 1 tablespoon at a time. If the dough is too sticky, add extra flour, 1 tablespoon at a time. Transfer the dough to a floured work surface. With floured hands, knead the dough until it becomes smooth and elastic, about 10 to 12 minutes. Drizzle the inside of a clean bowl with olive oil. Put the dough in the bowl and cover loosely with plastic wrap or a damp kitchen towel. Set the bowl in a warm, draft-free place, until the dough has doubled in size, about 2 hours.

Using a fist, deflate the dough in the center and cut it into 3 equal-sized pieces. Form the dough pieces into 3 balls and put into 3 oiled bowls. Cover each bowl loosely with plastic wrap or a damp kitchen towel and let rest for 1 hour. Remove the dough and wrap in plastic. Refrigerate for up to 1 day.

[Mark R]

I'd say it's good dough and a good hot pizza stone!

[barkonbutts]

Ah yes, another in search of the perfect crust!! Crust is much like bbq.... slow and stead and time is your friend.

First what is your recipe for dough? What type of flour are you using? What type of yeast are you using?

I use King Aurthor Bread flour and I have found this makes a HUGE difference in the taste. Yes different flours have a different taste!! I also cold rise my dough in the fridge for atleast 24 hours... I find closer to 48 is better. CUT YOUR YEAST IN HALF!!!! You do not need that much for a long cold rise.

Anyway give me a few more details... what temps are you cooking at. What are you cooking on?

Well that will give us a start!

Here is a photo of one on my last pizza's. I assume you are wanting a "hand tossed" dough. If that is not the case we need to know that as well!!

[Charcuteryan]

Im using a stone over charcoal. About 500F. As far as flour and yeast i use watever i find at the store. I can make dough, i just cant get it crispy on my grill. N if i do, the toppings arent done.

[dsgarner06]

Me personally, I always try to set the dough on the grill for about 3-4 minutes a side before I add any toppings and the crust is always perfect. Just take the dough and brush on some olive oil on both sides after you have made the pizza shape by rolling/stretching the dough. Throw it directly on the grill or on a very hot pizza stone to set the dough... then take it off, add the toppings and back on the grill to finish. I have found that the toppings melt better if the lid is closed to create a nice convection.

[barkonbutts]

Im using a stone over charcoal. About 500F. As far as flour and yeast i use watever i find at the store. I can make dough, i just cant get it crispy on my grill. N if i do, the toppings arent done.

How long is the stone on the grill prior to putting the pizza on the stone? My rule is you need atleast 45 minutes on heating for the stone to be truly hot. I know in my oven if I put a pizza on the stone when the oven says it is at temp the crust always comes out soft.... the stone just in not hot yet... You have to give it time to heat up..

Flour i really suggest you use a high gluten flour.. you will taste the difference trust me!! All purpose flour is not where you want to be for a pizza. yes you can use it and I did for years, but since switching I have been MUCH happier with the results, both in taste and texture!


I am looking into the pizza kettle thing... I might pull the trigger sooner rather than later... like this weekend!

[Charcuteryan]

I dont heat it that long maybe 20 minutes. Thanks, ill try evrything. Flour or oil on the stone?

[veryolddog]

"I am looking into the pizza kettle thing... I might pull the trigger sooner rather than later... like this weekend!" quote barkonbutts


I have been thinking about one of these as well. However, I am hesitant after watching a few YouTube videos on this subject. Apparently, all of the heat as it rises in a Weber Kettle completes the crust first. The top side is not finished. In order to get by this, the company owner recommended lifting the pizza off of the stone on the pizza peel and lifted so that it would be higher under the dome of the lid of the Weber Kettle. That's where the heat collects. In a short time the topside of the pizza was done.

There were also some videos that showed how to lower the dome with tin foil but that was really crude and the tin foil would split. I would think if you are going to spend $150.00 then it should work correctly.

Weber has a unit in England that really makes sense. But there is no timetable for this to be marketed in the USA.

There is another alternative put out by Cajun Bandit for the Weber Kettle. It is a stainless steel BBQ stacker for the kettle that increases its height by 50 per cent and places the grate significantly higher than the standard grate height. For $159.00 you buy the stainless steel stacker ring, a heat diffuser and a charcoal ring. By using this combination, you can get the bottom of the pizza to cook evenly without burning and the heat concentration in the dome will finish the the toppings at the same time. By the way, this is also used to convert the Weber kettle to a more versatile smoker and the parts are interchangeable with the WSM. Here's the link:

http://cajunbandit.com

I spoke to Weber about when they might offer their pizza oven in the USA and it is indefinite so I may be purchasing this alternative very shortly.

Ed

[Charcuteryan]

What if i made a stainless arch to dome over the pizza?

[barkonbutts]

I dont heat it that long maybe 20 minutes. Thanks, ill try evrything. Flour or oil on the stone?

I have never put anything on my stone... but my stone is now black.... well seasoned!! I did season it with biscuits to start.. you know those buttery ones you buy in the "pop" canister.... after that nothing but love from the food!!

I think you will be much happier with longer time on the heat up!! Good luck!

[barkonbutts]

"I am looking into the pizza kettle thing... I might pull the trigger sooner rather than later... like this weekend!" quote barkonbutts


I have been thinking about one of these as well. However, I am hesitant after watching a few YouTube videos on this subject. Apparently, all of the heat as it rises in a Weber Kettle completes the crust first. The top side is not finished. In order to get by this, the company owner recommended lifting the pizza off of the stone on the pizza peel and lifted so that it would be higher under the dome of the lid of the Weber Kettle. That's where the heat collects. In a short time the topside of the pizza was done.


Ed

Yeah i hear ya.. I saw a guy who added a stone on top as well and made like a box out of it and it seemed to work well.. It is a bit steep at 150.00 but heck i have pissed that away on other crap before as well.... Heck I paid that is beer the other weekend for the friends who came in from out of town for the weekend... atleast here I get something other than a mess...

[curious aardvark]

get a bread machine - takes all the hassle out of it.

And like dsgarner, I've started to pre-bake the base before adding toppings.

But the main thing is what do you want out of a pizza base - personally i don't like crispy.

I want the dough to be cooked, but still soft. crispy to me is over cooked.

this is what I aim for:



I also make them big and square :-)



Went to my favourite fish and chip shop week or so back and while I was waiting for the fish to be cooked I watched one of the guys making a big pizza. To be precise I was sat on the windowsill when i saw him start stabbing something behind the counter, so I had to go look.

He was using somethig a bit like a jackard meat tenderiser, but with cocktail sticks not blades - to stab small holes all over the pizza base. I asked why and he reckoned it stopped air bubbles in the dough and helped the base cook.

So that's another tip - stab little holes in the dough before saucing.

Flour matters - a lot.
You want a strong bread flour, plenty of gluten, that's what gives the dough stretch and structure.

My dough recipe is for the bread machine.

Pizza dough recipe
add to machine in this order.

1 cup warm water
1/2 tsp salt
4 tsp sugar
3 tbs olive oil
1 tsp garlic puree OR 1 large clove garlic pureed on my french garlic grater
3 cups white bread flour
2 tsp mixed italian herbs/seasoning

Set it to be ready about 60 mins before you want to eat.


My Instant tomato sauce base. If you don't have a magic bullet use a blender.

Instant Super tasty pizza sauce
Add 2/3 a can of chopped tomatos (approx 300gms/ 11oz) to the big beaker of a magic bullet or to a blender.
1 tsp mixed italian herbs/seasoning
2 tsp dried onion
2 tsp honey
1tbs white wine vinegar
1 level tsp garlic powder
1 tsp dried basil or half a dozen fresh basil leaves.

Blitz till smooth. Enough for 2 large or 4 small pizzas.

The dried herbs and onion help thicken it so I tend to mix about an hour before it's needed, to give it time to thicken.

Right I'm off to stuff some bratwurst and morrocan style sausage :-)
Hasta la pizza

[barkonbutts]

He was using somethig a bit likt a meat tenderiser to stab small holes all over the pizza base. I asked hwy and he reckoned it stopped air bubbles in the dough and helped the base cook.
.

That is called "docking" the dough. they do this if the dough has been sitting for a while and has formed a bunch of air pockets... it keeps the dough from getting those big dough bubbles in the pizza... I like them.. i do not dock.. but if you are in the restaurant business most customers complain if there are those bubbles in the dough... thus they do this to keep the complaints from happening... you will notice papa johns do this all the time and will see the holes in the crust when you buy one.. that is because their dough rest for like 5-7 days prior to use.

This has nothing to do with cooking the dough quicker... it simply pops the air bubbles!!